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03-10-1987 - PLANNING AND ZONING MINUTES The Planning and Zoning Commission convened in a regular session on Tuesday, March 10, 1987 at 7:00 p.m. in the Municipal Complex Conference Room, 1400. Live Oak Road. Those present were as follows PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION OTHERS PRESENT THOMAS YARLING, CHAIRMAN ROBERT W. WUEST BOB ANDREWS, VICE-CHAIRMAN EUGENE U. BROWN MERWIN WILLMAN CHARLES ECHLER KEITH VAN DINE RICHARD DE MUNBRUN DAVID ALLEN JAMES EDWARDS ' KEN GREENWALD, COUNCILMAN MEMBERS ABSENT TY BRISGILL JAMES HARDEN,SECRETARY CITY STAFF STEVE SIMONSON, ASST. CITY MGR. ALICE AUSTIN, DEPUTY CITY SECRETARY #1 CALL TO ORDER Chairman Yarling called the meeting to order at 7:00 p.m. #2 APPROVAL OF MINUTES: A. Regular Session February 24, 1987 Bob Andrews suggested that page 2 ,Item 4 paragraph 6 be changed to reflect "approximately 4 feet high and 3 1/2 feet wide. David Allen made the motion to approve the minutes of the Regular Session February 24, 1987 as amended. Bob Andrews seconded the motion which carried with the following vote: AYES: B. Andrews, M. Willman, K. VanDine, D. Allen and T. Yarling. NAYS: None B. Special Session March 3, 1987 Bob Andrews advised that page 6, paragraph 1 last sentence did not appear to be correct. He requested that the tape of the meeting be checked. and item .c hanged if necessary. David Allen made the motion to approve the minutes after staff had checked tape and made amendment to minutes if necessary. 1 _ , ..w... _ a (page 6, -paragraph.l, last sentence is .changed to read "Darwin Peek also stated that if there is a stub-out, onto his property, at the end of the cul-de-sac on Dimrock he plans to develop it onto Maske Road." #3 CITIZEN'S INPUT OTHER THAN AGENDA ITEMS: None #4 CONSIDER AND MAKE RECOMMENQATION: Sign Ordinance(Discussion on Variances in Relation to the Sign Ordinance) Tom Yarling advised that comments had been received from staff concerning the sign ordinance. He requested Steve Simonson bring Commission up to date. Steve Simonson advised that Don Brodeur had been asked to check out and submit questions concerning sign ordinance. The items Don Brodeur submitted were concerning: Set back: In calling other cities he finds San Antonio and a lot of other cities have almost no set back(1 foot off the line or on the line) because your still not impeding traffic because of right of way and things of that nature. Restriction on secondary or auxiliary signs and items of this nature. Portable or mobile signs because of the way it is written in the ordinance is extremely restrictive as far as cost and it's very nebulous as far as time frame. Might have more items but we are not to worried about sign height, and items of that nature we can live with things like that. Set back, auxiliary signs and the way our ordinance is written from side yard set back, the visibility triangle setback and the set back from right of way created a very bunched effect. David Allen said that the first thing that needed to be done was to decide if they are serious in writing the overlay district in the desires for the appearance of the City of Schertz. He said if we are serious that he thinks what is written in the ordinance is very workable. Steve Simonson advised that: Staff was requesting clarification because its being challenge* so much. One we look at conditions such as these. gentlemen are building. Forget the sign that they are requesting for the Pic N Pac, its confusing to use because you say they can have only one free standing sign per shopping area or whatever it is. If they put up a mobile sign, does that mean that is the free standing sign and the other businesses can not have anything. That's the way the ordinance reads, that's what it looks like to us. Number two is a little bit confusing on what they are allowed on the front of their building. The 2 canopy is only allowed one side sign, nothing on .building or other side of canopy. Most people do not have any problem with - sign height and area. The problem is strictly the way it is written compressing sign giving no lateral* room at.all if you have a hundred feet, you have to come 5.0 feet this way and 25 feet this way you have 25 feet left to put the sign: Mr. Allen advised that the intent of the ordinance was to limit businesses to one pole sign, preferably low profile in shopping center situations and not have every business putting up individual pole sign. MR. JAMES HARDEN ARRIVED AT 7:30 P.M. Mr. Greenwald advised that Mr. Brodeur was looking for clarification on how the Commissior. felt these particular items should be interpreted. He also advised that we may need a slight adjustment in the language of the ordinance. Bob Andrews advised that shopping centers must have something besides the name of the center on a pylon sign to get people to come in. According the the ordinance, if the name of the center was put up that would be the only sign allowed. He was also concerned with the type of sign allowed for individual businesses. James Harden advised that he felt the height and set back restriction needed to be addressed, especially along I-35. An example was the Austin Hiway Diner who's sign could not be seen from I-35 if they complied with current set back. Dave Allen made the motion to table Sign Ordinance and reschedule on the next agenda. Merwin Willman seconded the motion which carried with the following vote: AYES: M. Willman, J. Harden, K. VanDine, D. Allen and T. Yarling NAYS: Bob Andrews #S. CONSIDER AND TAKE APPROPRIATE ACTION: Johnson-Dempsey & Associates, Inc. - Request for Sign Variance. Mr. Richard De Munbrun advised that they were. asking. for a ` variance to the sign ordinance because they felt that compliance would create a hardship. Their business would be a convenience store with gas pumps. Set back from side property line is only 2 foot off. If they comply with ordinance the sign would be in the driveway. Front set back would put the sign in the parking area. If they eliminated parking spaces for sign they would be in violation of Zoning Ordinance. He advised that they were asking for asking for one sign for 180 feet of frontage. They are proposing a small-standing sign on poles. Mr. De Munbrun 3 advised that.all future business would be allowed only signs mounted- on the front of their businesses. The Pic N Pac store _ name would be on their canopy. Mr. De Munbrun advised that even if FM 78 were widened the height of their requested signs would not allow them to fall onto the street. David Allen made the motion to approve the variance requested by Johnson-Dempsey & Associates, Inc. James Harden seconded the motion which carried with the following vote: AYES: M. Willman, J. Harden, K. VanDine, D. Allen, B. Andrews and T. Yarling NAYS: None #b CONSIDER AND TAKE APPROPRIATE ACTION: B & J Lawn Care- Request for Sign Variance. Mr. James Edwards advised that he was requesting two signs located either side of the Animal Shelter on FM 1518. If he complied with the Sign Ordinance on set back, one of his signs would be in the middle of the creek and the other would be in the middle of the woods. Neither sign would we visible from the roadcaay. He advised that he was requesting one sign 200 feet south of the Animal Shelter and 35 feet off the pavement. The other sign would be 105 feet north of the Animal Shelter and 50 foot off the pavement. Height of signs would be 8 feet. Mr. Edwards advised that this was a temporary measure to let people know where his business is located. He Advised that once :z:t; building began on the other side of FM 1518 his signs would be taken down.. Mr. Edwards said that he felt this was a hardship situation because compliance with the ordinance would make it impossible for persons passing on FM 1518 to see his signs. David Allen made the motion to grant the variance as requested by James Edwards. James Harden seconded the motion which carried with the following vote: AYES: J. Harden, K. VanDine, D. Allen, T. Yarling, B. Andrews NAYES: None ABSTENSIONS: M. Willman #7 CONSIDER AND MAKE RECOMMENDATION: Change Name of FM 3009 Overlay District Ordinance to Jack ' Hays Boulevard Overlay District Ordinance. Mr. Willman advised that the overlay district was started prior to renaming FM 3009 to Jack Hays Boulevard. He advised that there was a need to rename to the ordinance to the Jack Hays Boulevard Overlay Ordinance-and to change the .area to be limited to the area from I 35 to FM 78. 4 Mr. Willman made the motion tQ recommend to City Council the~the title be changed to Special Overlay Jack Hays Boulevard-and that Article 19, Section 2, paragraph 2.1 be changed to add "from the intersection of IH 35 & Jack Hays. Boulevard to the intersection. of FM 78 and Jack Hays Boulevard. Bob Andrews seconded the motion which carried with the following vote: AYES: M. Willman, J. Harden, K. VanDine, T. Yarling and B. Andrews. NAYS: None ABSTENTIONS: D. Allen #8 GENERAL DISCUSSION: Bob Andrews advised that the sign ordinance needed the word "hardship" and a definition. Need to have something in the ordinance that staff could point to and say you can ask for variance but you must show hardship. He said that some of the requests for variances could be eliminated if a hardship had to be proven. He said that everything he had been reading from Planning and Zoning bulletin showed that variances joining two lots they quote a page and paragraph number and the reason why the variance was or was not granted. Mr. Simonson advised that one of the questions most often asked was "What do you think our chances are. He also advised that the Zoning Ordinance gives some guidelines on what you might want to put in defining hardship. It specifies environmental, neighborhood, economic There are four items you need to look at in the zoning ordinance before you change it. Bob Andrews ask if anything had been found out about the call in Schermerville on the accident. Mr. Simonson advised that the ambulance left the barn within 60 seconds after the call was received. Total from time call was received until ambulance arrived on the scene was 14 minutes. The only thing we can think of is that the first call went into 911. Our records show only one call coming in. Mr. Allen asked if the city was becoming a part of the new 911 system. Mr. Greenwald advised that we would be joining and it should start working in 18 to 24 months. Steve Simonson advised that .one of the items staff was looking into is something to do with 78, Schertz Parkway and better ingress and egress into the city from the south side of the City. Steve Simonson said that they would have groundbreaking for the Schertz Parkway on the 16 or 17 at noon. .Invitations-would be_ coming for City Council and P&Z. 5 rv. " p _ Ken Greenwald advised that City Staff had been. asked to look into - what would ha-ve to be done in appointing alternates to the Planning & Zoning Commission. Mr. Simonson advised that he did have the information back from Live Oak and in looking at. it and would be getting something to the commission for the next meeting. Mr. Greenwald requested that members not refer to nine one one as nine eleven. This creates confusion for small children looking for an eleven. Mr. Allen asked if this. would be a new system. Mr. Simonson advised that this would. be a totally automated system. Mr. Greenwald advised that Ma Bell would come out before system was implemented and find out what our area of coverage is. They will then go back and program the system and calls in our coverage system will come to our department. Merwin Willman advised that he had promised verbage on a new. zoning district for the area South of Randolph and that he finally had the information. He advised that he had given them some of his reasoning on the handout he had given commission. He advised that the proper district would be RA/Single Family Residential Agricultural District. He. advised that he had worked up some new definitions and schedule of uses and a sketch of area and list of references. He also said that there was a proposed change to the AACUZ Overlay District. He advised that although he ;:ig had started this to apply to the area South of Randolph but had realized that this district might be applied to other areas of the city as well. Mr. Willman advised that the Schertz Parkway Overlay did not have boundaries. Mr. Simonson advised that the Ordinance did now have boundaries. James Harden said that a couple of weeks ago when Vaughan was in on that street in Greenshire and his argument was a curb and trees back from that. He advised that a couple of builders had been in his office and they were discussing it. He advised .that the engineers were going to require 8 feet or they would not guarantee the slab for a house with trees. .lames Harden then asked Steve Simonson about the drain on :Jack Hays and if the collector was going to be in the right of way. Steve Simonson advised that it would take the water coming off of the property and that coming down from the other property. We will have to regrade the right of way so where it used to come to the' other culvert it will divert it down. Mr. Simonson also advised that this would not be an open drainage collector. 6 Mr. Harden also re-quested size of .the Drainage boxes at Crest _Oak. Mr. Simonson advised that they would be 6 x 8 foot boxes with 30 foot- street. Keith Van Dine advised that Pfeil Road was still in need of repair. Some of the roadway had been patched in the area where they had been working on the water line. Mr. Van. Dine said he had put out the word in the Schermerville area about needing volunteer firemen and would advise if anyone was interested. He also advised Mr. Willman that he would be in contact with the committee before next week and get some input from them. Mr. Van Dine advised that he had been approached by the speed limit signs and that many people felt that 20 MPH was too slow. He asked what could be done to change the speed limit to 30 MPH. Mr. Simonson advised that this was the normal speed limit-for a residential speed limit and that all that would have to be done was have the people petition the Council to change the speed limit. Mr. Greenwald asked if Mr. Van Dine could bring up at Schermerville zoning committee meeting the possibility of changin-g the name of Pfeil Road. Mr. Van Dine advised that he had raised the question before and the and the response was that the people out there like it as Pfeil Road. Mr. Allen asked why when Woodland Oaks came in for their original plat why they got approval without any stubouts. He advised that this was a long street with no stubouts. Mr. Willman advised tY~at there was nop reason at the time. Mr. Allen asked if a letter on blinking light signs had been sent to SAS. Mr. Simonson advised that a letter v,~as not sent to SAS as he had been told that they had a special variance from Council. Mr. Allen requested that Mr. Simonson check on the variance. Mr. Allen asked if there was any ordinance prohibiting the parking of large vehicles on the roadway in Schertz. He advised that there were some people in a motor home who pulled over and parked on Main Street and a policeman came and told them they had to leave. Mr. Allen also advised that the motor home parked behind Carolyns Beauty Salon .was dumping his holding tanks onto the. ground. He also said that since the city was working to control signs was there not something that could be done to control the amount of signs the Highway. Department- was putting up. Mr. Simonson advised that we had no control over the Highway Department. 7 Mr. Yarling ,advised that the next regular scheduled meeting would be in two weeks. Mr. Andrews requested that the ordinance concerning satalite recieving dishes be place on the next regular agenda. Mr. Harden asked if Mr. Simonson could check on No Parking Signs for I 35. Mr. Simonson advised that he had already requested signs. #9 ADJOURNMENT The meeting was adjourned at 9:30 p.m. 8