07-12-1988 PLANNING AND ZONING MINUTES
The Schertz Planning and Zoning Commission convened in a regular
session on Tuesday, July 12, 1988 at 7:00 P.M. in the MunicipaY
Complex Conference Room, 1400 Live Oak Road. Those present were
as follows:
PLANNING & ZONING COMMISSION OTHERS PRESENT
BOB ANDREWS, CHAIRMAN JOHN E. PAPAGOLOS,
TY BRISGILL VICE-CHAIRMAN TRAMMELL CROW CO.
KEITH VAN DINE, SECRETARY RICK EVANS, JACK
MERWIN WILLMAN IN THE BOX
MARY MARSH JIM SHRIVER, SCHERTZ
JOE POTEMPA BUSINESS CLUB
KEN GREENWALD, COUNCILMAN JOEL LOEHMAN
MEMBERS ABSENT CITY STAFF
GEORGE VICK STEVE SIMONSON, CITY MGR.
NORMA ALTHOUSE,
RECORDING SECRETARY
#1 CALL TO ORDER
Chairman Andrews called the meeting to order at 7:00 P.M.
#2 APPROVAL OL' MINUTES: Regular Session June 28, 1988
Mary Marsh asked that on Page 3, Paragraph 3, where it reads
"Ford Engineering", it be changed in both instances to read "the
City Engineer".
Merwin Willman made a motion to approve the minutes, as amended,
for the regular session June 28, 1988. Keith Van Dine seconded
the motion and the vote was as follows:
AYES: B. Andrews, K. Van Dine, M. Willman, M. Marsh, J. Potempa
NAYS: None
ABSTENTIONS: T. Brisgill
Motion carried.
#3 CITIZENS' INPUT OTHER THAN AGENDA ITEMS
There was none.
#4 CONSIDER AND TAKE APPROPRIATE ACTION: Trammell Crow Co.
Request for One Year Extension of Permit for
Thistle Creek Subdivision Sign
John Papagolos of Trammell Crow was at the meeting to represent
this request.
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Chairman Andrews asked if there was any further input from
Trammell Crow. Steve Simonson replied he had received a letter
from ,John Papagolos in June asking for consideration of an
extension of the permit for the Thistle Creek Subdivision sign.
Mr. Simonson said he asked the Commission their feelings on this
at the last meeting and they recommended sending a letter to John
Papagolos informing him of when the next Planning and Zoning
meeting would be held and asking for his presence at the meeting
to answer questions. Mr. Simonson further stated that John
Papagolos is present at the meeting tonight to speak on his own
behalf .
John Papagolos passed out a plat to illustrate Thistle Creek
Phase I, saying it has a total of 140 lots, 43 of which still
remain vacant. Mr. Papagolos did say three houses are under
construction and this represents a 69% build-out with 31o still
remaining to be built. Mr.~Papagolos also stated that Trammell
Crow owns the remaining acreage in Thistle Creek which will
accommodate 563 lots.
John Papagolos stressed that without signs, builders cannot
successfully market their product. He said Morton Southwest has
closed it's model home in Thistle Creek and is marketing out of
their Cimmarron Subdivision location, sending prospective buyers
to look at homes in Thistle Creek and it is vital to have the
sign there for direction. Mr. Papagolos also stated that Pulte
has closed it's model-home in Thistle Creek, but is continuing to
build.
John Papagolos commented it is his understanding the original
request for permitting the sign was granted with the agreement
that it was for 3 years, renewable annually, or a 75o buildout of
the subdivision, whichever came first. Mr. Papagolos pointed out
that since it is not yet 75% built-out, this would be asking for
the third year of the three year agreement and he would
appreciate the Commission's consideration of this request for a
renewal. _
Chairman Andrews remarked that he wasn't sure of the need for the
sign since there are apparently no other phases of Thistle Creek
on the drawing board.
John Papagolos responded by saying there is another phase on the
drawing board and they will be putting in new water lines in
conjunction with the City of Cibolo. Mr. Papagolos stated he had
spoken with representatives of the City of Cibolo just that
afternoon.
Ty Brisgill asked if Rob Sult is still with Trammell Crow and
John Papagolcs replied that Mr. Sult is new with the Commercial
Division.
Ty Brisgill then asked if a letter that had been sent on March
23, 1988 by Steve Simonson, saying they needed to renew their
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permit, had been received and John Papagolos said probably the
ball had been dropped in that case because that was when some
reorganizing of the company was going on.
Ty Brisgill emphasized that one of his major concerns in working
with Trammell Crow is the dealing in miles, that we need a more
concrete contact for the City.
John Papagolos assured Mr. Brisgill that the City can contact him
at anytime and he will handle the situation.
Chairman Andrews commented it has been a continual pattern in the
past for the City to get no response from Trammell Crow until the
privilege was denied. Mr. Andrews pointed out specifically that
the City of Schertz has an Overlay Ordinance for Jack Hays Blvd.
allowing signs only for on-site developments and that we made an
exception and agreed to let Thistle Creek have their sign after
they were refused permission for a sign by the City of Cibolo.
John Papagolos asked what the past problems were that the City
had encountered with Trammell Crow.
Chairman Andrews replied the problem had been mostly with the
bandit signs put up by Pulte - they were almost continually in
violation of either the number of signs or the spacing permitted
between signs.
Chairman Andrews stated that the .Commission is concerned with
aesthetics because of Jack Hays Blvd. being one of the entrances
coming into the City. Mr. Andrews further said that maintenance
and upkeep were one of the reasons for the renewal requirement
for the sign.
John Papagolos did point aut that the sign had been well
maintained and would continue to be well maintained by Trammell
Crow.
Merwin Willman made a motion to approve the request from Trammell
Crow for a one-year renewal of the permit for the Thistle Creek
Subdivision sign effective March 1, 1988. Mary Marsh seconded
the motion and the vote was unanimous in favor. Motion carried.
After the vote Chairman Andrews brought up the fact that it would
be advantageous for the permits to be issued to John Papagolos.
Ken Greenwald explained that what we need is a letter from John
Papagolos explaining the transfer of Rob Sult to ancther division
and therefore requesting that the permits now be put in Mr.
Papagolcs' name.
Steve Simonson informed John Papagolos he will be sending him a
letter and will include a copy of the Overlay Ordinance. Mr.
Simonson said he will need in return a letter stating that
Trammell Crow will follow the guidelines of the Overlay
Ordinance.
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~5 CONSIDER AND TAKE APPROPRIATE ACTION: Joel & Debbie
Loehman - Request for a Backyard Setback Variance at 128 Lincoln
Drive
Joel Loehman was at the meeting to represent this request.
Chairman Andrews asked if there was any Staff input.
Before that question could be 'answered, Ty Brisgill interrupted
to inquire as to why the Planning and Zoning Commission should be
considering a variance for this request. Mr. Brisgill said it
seems to be more a matter of access and a property line dispute
which are not the Commission's problems.
Joel Loehman- spoke up to say that he had called the City
Inspector and was informed he; would not be issued a permit to
move his fence back 16' until he had the approval of the Planning
and Zoning Commission.
Merwin Willman commented the ordinance states what is permitted
and it can be done if he provides access to the easement.
Steve Simonson said the Inspector had a question on it and so he
thought he would run it by the Planning and Zoning Commission.
Mr. Simonson went on to say there obviously is no problem.
The consensus of the Commission was that this item be turned back
over to the Inspection Department.
~6 CONSIDER AND TAKE APPROPRIATE ACTIOAT: The Berne Group,
Inc., cn Behalf of Jack in the Box
Restaurants, Request for Variance to Sign
Ordinance
Ricls Evans of Jack in the Box Restaurants was at t:ze meting to
represent this request.
Chairman Andrews asked if there was any Staff input and Steve
Simcnson replied there was none. Mr. Simonson went on tc say
that the people from Jack in the Box have all the ordinances and
a.re also aware of the building codes.
Chairman Andrews informed the Commission this request is for two
variances - one for the height and one fcr the number cf sides cn
the sign.
Mary Marsh commented they had provided a very nice package and
that she saw nothing wrong with granting both variances. Mrs.
Marsh went on to .say the four-sided sign is their logo and it is
a national logo.
Merwin Willman remarked that the Commission had granted variances
before when it is a national logo.
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.Chairman Andrews said he agreed only with the variance for. the
four-sided. sign, he has some questions on the 75' height.
,Rick Evans explained that they had trucks with booms come out and
put up the sign and they-drove up and down the interstate
checking the visibility of the sign at different elevations. Mr.
Evans said .there is no problem northbound, but. there is a problem
:southbound because they are tucked back in the corner. Mr. Evans
said at 50' their sign would be behind Stop-N-Go and so they feel
75' is necessary.
Chairman Andrews, stating he is always trying to look ahead, said
he fully visualizes, in 3 to 5 years, a lot going on at that
corner and asked what happens if each new business that comes in
.wants their sign higher. Mr. Andrews said they will look at Jack
in. the Box and say they were granted a variance for a higher
:sign, and thus expect to be granted a similar variance.
Rick Evans indicated that he thought Jack in the Box should
receive some consideration because, in times like these, they
are stepping to the forefront with their dollars.
Mary Marsh pointed out there is such a thing as placement of
signs, and others that come later will have to take that into
consideration.
Mary Marsh asked if they had checked the effect of wind velocity
on the sign and Rick Evans replied that they had.
There was a brief discussion on the size of the sign with Ty
Brisgill asking if the 250 total square footage allowed was an
overall total of all sides or a total fcr one side. The
consensus of the Commission was that it is a total f_cr one side.
Ty Brisgill told Rick Evans he was very impressed with their
package and wished everyone would provide the Commission with as
much information when requesting a variance. Mr. Brisgill said
good information makes the Commission's job much easier.
Keith Van Dine made a motion to approve the request from Jack in
the Box for two variances to the Sign Ordinance: (1) a variance
allowing them to have a four-sided sign because it is their
national Iogo and (2) a 25' variance allowing thorn to have a sign
75' in height, a necessity because of the curve in the road to
allow southbound traffic on If3-35 to be able t:~ see their sign in
time to take the FM 3009 exit.
Joe Potempa seconded the motion and the vote was as f:~llows:
AYES: B. Andrews, K. Vari Dine, M. Marsh, J. Potem~=a
WAYS: T. Brisgill, M. Willmar.
ABSTENTIONS: None
Motion carried.
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#7 GENERAL DISCOSSION
Merwin Willman reminded the Commission about the letter in their
packages requesting funds to be included in the next proposed
budget.
Mary Marsh asked if the funds requested for books would be enough
and Steve Simonson informed Mrs. Marsh we do have some books
already on hand.
Chairman Andrews said George Vick had called him to say he may be
absent for 3 or 4 meetings - a member of his family is seriously
ill.
Keith Van Dine had brought a packet of information pertaining to
Texas Department of Correction facilities and told everyone they
were welcome to look it over. Mr. Van Dine said at the moment
TDC has enough potential sites, but if anyone wants to put in a
bid, they will put you on the list.
Mary Marsh said she had made numerous attempts to get hold of
Randy Grossman, but had been unsuccessful so far.
Mr. Grossman has not turned in the books and material supplied to
him when he was a Commission member and so it was suggested that
he be sent a letter by return receipt mail.
Steve Simonson, referencing a couple of questions that were asked
of him at the last meeting, informed the Commission of the
following: (1) Salvage Enterprises refused to answer a letter, so
they have been sent a citation, and (2) Joseph Marks did not
agree to paint the metal fence at his junkyard on FM 1518.
Steve Simonson told the Commission he had been approached by some
representatives of MediPure who are interested in establishing
their business in the old Star Tile building. Their business is
the incineration of infectious and biomedical waste.
Mr. Simonson said they had previcusly tried to locate at IH-35
and Laop 410 but San Antonio disapproved their request due to
citizen protest.
Mr. Simonson said, unless there is something in the ordinance he
is not aware of, he found nothing to preclude them from
establishing their business in Schertz and he would like to have
the thoughts of the Commission on this possibility. Mr. Simonson
further stated they have to meet all kinds of regulations and
specifications and obtain all kinds of permits to operate their
facility.
Steve Simonson explained a little bit of their operation to the
Commission and said they had indicated they would be glad to came
and speak to the Commission if they were interested.
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Merwin Willman commented that if the City of Schertz is
interested, he thinks it would be best to recommend they apply
.for a Specific Use Permit so as to allow the City more control.
After some discussion on possible hazardous conditions, tax base,
number of people they may employ, and objections that may be
voiced if it would go to a public hearing, the Commission
recommended Steve Simonson look into it further by talking to the
City Managers of the other cities in Texas where MediPure has
located to see how things have worked out with them.
#S ADJOURNMENT
Chairman Andrews adjourned the meeting at 8:17 P.M.
The next regularly scheduled meeting is July 26, 1988.
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