11-26-1996
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PLANNING AND ZONING MINUTES
The Schertz Planning and Zoning Commission convened in
session on Tuesday, November 26, 1996 at 7:00 p.m.
Municipal Complex Bob Andrews Conference Room, 1400
Parkway, Schertz, Texas. Those present were as follows:
regular
in the
Schertz
PLANNING & ZONING COMMISSION
CITY STAFF
ERNIE EVANS, CHAIRMAN
DAVID RICHMOND, VICE-CHAIRMAN
MERWIN WILLMAN, SECRETARY
PIA JARMAN
TONY MORENO
GARY WALLACE
KEN GREENWALD, COUNCILMAN
STEVE SIMONSON,
ASST. CITY MANAGER
DENISE GRANGER,
PLANNING SECRETARY
MEMBERS ABSENT
KEITH VAN DINE (Work Related)
OTHERS PRESENT
Ron Krape,
Veytia Partners
Bill Reeves,
Marmon Mok
Tanya Harrison,
1401 Schertz Parkway
Melvin Golla,
Schertz Bank & Trust
Ray Inman,
Wetmore Land Surveying
John Krauss,
Pape Dawson
Joe Veytia,
Veytia Partners
Joe Haynes,
9A Upper Cibolo Cr.
* 1 CALL TO ORDER
Chairman Ernie Evans called the November 26, 1996 regular meeting
to order at 7:00 p.m.
*2 APPROVAL OF MINUTES:
Public Hearing and Regular Session November 12, 1996.
Merwin Willman moved to approve the Public Hearing
Session minutes of November 12, 1996. Pia Jarman
motion which carried with a unanimous vote.
and Regular
seconded the
*3 STATUS OF FINAL PLATS:
There were none.
*4
CITIZENS' INPUT OTHER THAN AGENDA ITEMS:
There were none.
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*5
CONSIDER AND TAKE APPROPRIATE ACTION: Request from M.W. Cude
L.L.C., Engineers, Preliminary and Final Plat
Approval for the Vacate and Replat of Lots 59
and 60, Grove Park Woodland Oaks Unit 6A.
(PC #293-96)
Steve Simonson stated a letter was received today from M.W. Cude
withdrawing this item from the agenda on behalf of the owners as a
letter from the owners was requested to go with the plat, stating
the owners' approval of this to be used as a ROW between their
homes. M.W. Cude would like the homeowners to sign off on the
plat to that effect.
*6 CONSIDER AND TAKE APPROPRIATE ACTION: Request from Pape
Dawson Engineers, Preliminary and Final Plat
Approval for the Vacate and Replat of Lots 3
and 4 in Unit 1, and Lots 5 and 6 in Unit 2,
Tri-County Business Park. (PC #291-96)
.
Steve Simonson stated this replat is necessary due to the drainage,
the size of the building and the land. During the site plan for
this particular project the sheet flow was supposed to go off the
back of the land and go through a type of curbing with a natural
flow. Because of the overall size of the drainage, particularly on
the sides, they have had to purchase additional land which meant
that they could no longer use the two lots they are on. We now
have a replat which involves Unit 1 and Unit 2. After discussion
with Pape Dawson and Ford Engineering, it was decided to name this
lot 5 block 1 of Unit 1 to continue with the same uniformity with
Unit 1.
Steve Simonson stated there are several items missing on the plat
there is no flood plain statement, the information about the San
Antonio Water System will need to be changed to the Schertz Water
System, and the property owners on each side of the lot need to be
named. All other information on the plat that is required is
shown.
Ernie Evans stated on the agenda it is Pape Dawson Engineers on the
check list application it is SCI Development. Steve Simonson
stated SCI Developers is the developer for the project and Pape
Dawson is the engineer preparing the plat.
Ernie Evans stated on the application the preliminary and final are
not checked. Steve stated because there was some corrections to be
made so this was brought forward to the Commission for approval
with the statement and corrections being done. As indicated in the
past the Commissioners have wanted this option.
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Pia Jarman stated this is a preliminary and final plat. Steve
Simonson stated normally when we have a replat the preliminary and
final are done at the same time. However, because there were some
corrections that needed to be made and because of the comments from
the Commissioners in the past, it was brought before the Commission
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as a
same
done.
preliminary. A preliminary and final could be done in the
night since it is strictly a word correction that needs to be
Gary Wallace asked if the corrections have to be done before the
final. Steve Simonson said "yes" the corrections have to be made
before the final. If the Commission approves the final tonight
Pape Dawson will receive a letter on what needs to be corrected.
When the corrections are made then the mylars can be filled in our
office with the Chairman and Secretary having to sign the mylars
and making sure that they are correct.
Ernie Evans mentioned if the Commission will remember
plats there is no contingencies it is either correct
correct. There is not a system other than our memory.
on final
or not
Pia Jarman moved to approve the preliminary plat for the vacate and
replat for lots 3 and 4 in Unit 1, and lots 5 and 6 in Unit 2 of
the Tri-County Business Park submitted by Pape Dawson Engineers
provided that the following corrections are made; the flood plain
statement, correction from San Antonio to Schertz Water System be
noted, and that the property owners of the adjacent properties be
listed. Tony Moreno seconded the motion which carried with a
unanimous vote.
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*7
CONSIDER AND TAKE APPROPRIATE ACTION: Request from Wetmore
Land Surveying, Inc., Preliminary Plat Approval
Durnford Subdivision. (PC #292-96)
Steve Simonson stated this lot is in front of the La Petite on FM
3009 and Savannah Drive.
Ernie Evans asked about the property on the west side which is
indicated as being lot 1, block 16 Savannah Square Subdivision and
doesn't show the La Petite. Is not the property the La Petite
Academy? Steve Simonson stated that "yes" the property is the La
Petite, so the property owner is missing.
Ernie Evans asked where the proposed entrance would be located?
Ray Inman stated he did not know. Steve Simonson stated this would
be addressed at the time of the site plan since this is strictly a
plat. With the drainage the entrance and exit would most likely be
on Savannah Drive.
Gary Wallace moved to approve the request for the preliminary plat
submitted by Westmore Land Surveying, Inc. for Durnford
Subdivision contingent upon the inclusion of all adjacent property
owners. Tony Moreno seconded the motion which carried with a
unanimous vote.
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*8
CONSIDER AND TAKE APPROPRIATE ACTION: Request from Veytia
Partners, Master Plan Approval for Parkway
Villas Retirement Community Gated. (PC #289-96)
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Steve Simonson commented that there is one item that needs to be
reflected in the minutes and for the Commission to be aware of.
The UDC on gated communities reads nothing under 75 acres.
However, the wording on this is for single family dwelling units.
Although this is technically a single family dwelling unit it is
also a duplex type of set-up. But for the purposes of our minutes
and for clarity sake, we need to be aware of this distinction that
we did not discuss when it came through. We are safe as this is
not a zoning issue, that there needed to be a change to single
family dwelling. It is a SUP (Special Use Permit) type of
proposal.
Steve Simonson stated the items missing are the vicinity map scale,
a clear definition of the entrance, and the in/out turn on Schertz
Parkway.
Merwin Willman stated one of the requirements for a gated community
is that it should be at least 75 acres. This is a little over 8
acres. It could be considered as a duplex development but
considered as a single family residential gated community.
Steve Simonson stated this has passed us already with the request
for a SUP. This did not fit in any of the single family current
ordinance patterns.
Merwin Willman mentioned this was overlooked by him and the
Commission.
Pia Jarman stated the whole intent of the 75 acres had been
discussed because we would not then have small walled communities.
We were not thinking necessarily single family, duplex, or
multi-family; simply having small enclosures allover the City.
Initially Merwin had brought up 200 acres or whatever and then we
worked it down to 75 acres. We were thinking this was going to be
a condo type management and its size just went by the Commission.
Gary Wallace stated this particular parcel of land does not lend
itself to be restrictive. If we were out along Schertz Parkway
where there is a lot of land to be developed, we would not want it
cut up into small pieces. However, this particular parcel is
limited by its location.
Merwin Willman asked Gary what he meant by limited.
there is no way they will be able to get 75 acres
property.
Gary stated
out of this
Merwin Willman stated this is the reason why it was voted on 75
acres as mlnlmum. Mike Lancaster has 10 acres, which was before
our UDC was approved. We didn't want small acreage being bought up
and put into small gated communities. This UDC ruling was to
eliminated this.
Gary Wallace mentioned this request would be an exception to the
rule.
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Steve Simonson stated this is why this request was brought as a SUP
as it doesn't fit any of the existing zoning patterns that we have.
Pia Jarman wondered if this SUP would set a precedent for someone
else with another little area who wanted to put in another gated
community.
David Richmond stated we would need to go back and evaluate each
submission by its merits. We have an attempt, as Gary mentioned,
to use a parcel of land limited by size, surroundings and location
in a new and different type of use for the City: a retirement
community, which will need to be looked at in a special way.
Gary Wallace stated he still has a problem with Westchester being
cut off. We went to great lengths to locate a road before we
allowed a school to go in. Yet we want to cut the people of a
subdivision off to a single street.
Merwin Willman stated he likes the development
is doing but Merwin still has a funny feeling
being cut off. This has been in the plans for
get this as a through street and if we go along
planned this means it will never be done.
emotions on the whole concept.
and what Mr. Veytia
about Westchester
so many years, to
with what is being
Merwin has mixed
Ron Krape stated the rationale for not extending Westchester is the
concern that with the school from Elbel and the traffic in one
direction there will be less of a problem with less intersections
in the road. There will be children taking Westchester as a short
cut. The residents in Westchester would like for the road to be
done as it would give them an easier way out, but in time the
children will be using this road to cut through. This may be
something they may want to scarifice.
Merwin Willman mentioned the only children using this area would be
the ones living in the Village.
Ron Krape stated another problem is with the apartments where you
see cars parked all the time in the grass area. People use the
path ways already as shown by the tracks that are there. If you
put a road in you are going to have all these people using the road
to park instead of going to the parking lot. They will park on the
side of the road. Merwin mentioned this can be controlled by
putting no parking signs into effect on this street.
Merwin Willman mentioned that in the Village there have been
problems with only one entrance/exit into this subdivision. We are
cutting them off by not extending the road.
Joe Veytia stated the bottom line on all the questions
being asked is whether everyone agrees that a
subdivision has to have security. So the bottom line
Schertz want retired people that will inhabit these types
They feel there are more merits for why Schertz should
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that are
retirement
is, does
of units.
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this retirement community subdivision than there are negatives.
There will be low school impact, it will generate more retail
trade. As some solutions, as Ron has mentioned, there will be some
traffic impact negative to the school. The one thing that Joe
Veytia has heard that is a problem that is created by the Fourth of
July parade issue is: they need something on an emergency basis
for one day a year. There could be a possibility that the fence
could be backed away from the property line, so there will be a
passage way. It would not be paved as one to use routinely but one
to be used temporarily. Right now they are using the grass to cut
across that one time a year and this passage would be for emergency
use only.
Joe Veytia stated that on the issue of the Westchester extension
the developers feel very strongly that this will impact their
marketing to the degree that they would have to say they do not
want to take this deal and take this type of developer risk knowing
that they are surrounded by three particular spots. The issue of
the 75 acre concern, they are going to govern this community like a
condominium type of development. The only reason they came back
and cut the lots up was so they could sell the land with the
property and avoid this being sold as condominium, so it would open
up all the avenues of financing for these particular units that
anybody else buying a single family home would have in the City of
Schertz. "If we essentially sell the land but govern it as a
condominium type of community, we get the best of both deals: the
financing for the unit purchaser and running it like a multi-family
situation. I don't know if it was Schertz's intent to keep gated
multi-family condomimium type comunities out of Schertz, as there
are no 75 acre multi-family apartment type communities anywhere in
the state of Texas. In a certain sense this needs to be looked at
as a multi-family condominium type of development, and is that what
the particular ordinance was addressing?"
Merwin Willman stated he agrees with what Mr. Veytia has said
except bringing Westchester out. "How is this going to affect the
development of this community? You have not convinced me that it
is going to affect the development of this community in anyway. No
matter what type of development we have, you are always going to
have streets and traffic. The traffic that Westchester is going to
generate is from the people in the Village. Most of the people are
going to use Curtiss as they do now."
Joe Veytia stated if there wasn't a high school across the street
with the trails that the children have created now in the ditch,
which is proof that there is a point in the day or week that
someone is cutting across.
Merwin Willman mentioned that you may be blaming the high school
children for something that they are not doing.
Joe Veytia
because the
informed him.
school
people
children
have so
stated he knows that it is the high
librarian and the fire department
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Steve Simonson stated a lot of people were cutting across, for
reasons we did not know, through the parking lot of the library and
fire department and across Mr. Veytia's land to the apartments in
vehicles. It got so bad that there was a road there. We put up
barricades and had people out there to put a stop to it. Most of
the traffic, 95%, is from the apartment dwellers. At one point we
had a barricade across Westchester so it wasn't school children
driving in and out. There was a gathering area for the children
and this will continue one way or another.
Steve Simonson stated he would suspect although this is legally a
stubbed out street, the minute you open it up for traffic, the
people that have been living there 30 years in this nice quiet
little area are going to call and complain.
Pia Jarman asked Councilman Ken Greenwald, being a resident in this
area, how he thought the people feel.
Councilman Ken Greenwald stated he had only talked with one or two.
They don't like the idea of being blocked in but he couldn't speak
for the whole subdivision. One thing, instead of the entrance
being on the heavily traveled Schertz Parkway, why not move it to
Westchester?
Joe Veytia stated if you put an entrance there you will be creating
a road and this is not what we want. We are trying to avoid
creating that third major road. There are ways that the emergency
entrance can be set up so that people could come through the
emergency entrance through the subdivision. Once they are in, the
gate would automatically open out to let them out. They can
address the emergency situations, it is the every day, all year
long traffic that causes problems. They are willing to create a
turn lane onto Elbel from Schertz Parkway. This would eliminate
traffic congestion. Westchester would have some type of emergency
access in the situation that it is needed. The other possibility
is to pull the fence back 10 to 12 feet from the boundaries and
then they could get by from this development and the apartments in
the alley, but this would not be paved and could be used for that
one time a year situation (the Fourth of July).
Merwin Willman stated this is not the one day a year event that he
is concerned with. Westchester has been in the making in the
streets and road plans for at least 10 years that Westchester would
go out to Elbel Road. An emergency way of getting to it would not
solve the problem of what we have had in the plans.
Joe Veytia stated he feels that at the public hearing, the
residents are going to be out in force to make sure the road (i.e.
Westchester) does not go through. If it is not so then City
Council will stop them. "We think when the Westchester residents
see that, the negatives outweigh the positives. We are willing to
let everyone in Westchester know about this and they are going to
be willing to support this type of community over one that would
include Westchester being built out.
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Steve Simonson stated the public hearing has been set and the
notices have been sent out to include the people within 200'.
Ernie Evans
gate detail
entrance is
vicinity map
stated the distances on the map are incorrect and
that is required is not included, the depth of
imperative to get the cars off the road, and
is not shown.
the
the
the
Merwin Willman stated another concern that was talked about at the
last meeting, is the fencing around the area to be of some type of
solid fence with a vinyl covering.
Ron Krape stated it is wood with a vinyl covering to keep it clean
and it cannot be painted on. Merwin stated if we agree to that,
then there will have to be a variance granted. In the ordinance it
states it will be surrounded by a masonry or rod iron fence. For
the fencing that is proposed, there will have to be a variance
granted.
Merwin Willman asked if this would be a solid fence? Joe Veytia
stated originally they were going to propose a solid fence but to
make it look more decorative if they could use lattice about 1 to 2
feet on the top of the fence it would give it less of a wall
appearance but provide privacy as well.
Steve Simonson stated there is one more item that will need to be
addressed. At the corner of Schertz Parkway and Elbel Road there
has to be an open 50 X 50 clear view space that is required by our
ordinance. There will have to be a modification to the fence with
some low type of foliage but the fence will need to be brought back
so the property line corner will have a 50 X 50 clear view.
Joe Veytia stated they have no problem with this request of cutting
back the corner.
David Richmond stated on the fencing, facing to the high school,
with vandalism an issue, the one advantage of a masonry or brick
fence is despite spray painting and other attempts of defacing, you
can sand blast it basically with little effort and expense. What
is the solution of vinyl?
Joe Veytia stated paint doesn't stick. At this time they brought
in some samples for the Commission to look at.
Ernie Evans asked if the requirements for a gated community as far
as the HOA, maintenance, and budget agreements have to be
submitted?
Steve Simonson stated "yes", all gated community subdivisions have
to apply regardless of whether they are single family or
multi-family. We have to have the agreement because there will be
private streets in this subdivision. The streets have to be built
to the specifications of a minimum of 30' from the curb.
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Ernie Evans mentioned that the master plan has several items that
need to be corrected. The only other concern is Westchester.
Merwin Willman moved to table the request for the Master Plan
approval for Parkway Villas Retirement Community Gated submitted by
Veytia Partners, Ltd., until after the City Council Public Hearing
on December 3rd and it be put on the Planning and Zoning agenda for
December 10th. Gary Wallace seconded the motion which carried as
follows:
AYES: Ernie Evans, David Richmond, Merwin Willman, Pia Jarman,
Gary Wallace.
NAYS: Tony Moreno.
*9 CONSIDER AND TAKE APPROPRIATE ACTION: Request from Veytia
Partners, Preliminary Plat Approval for Parkway
Villas Retirement Community Gated. (PC #290-96)
Steve Simonson stated on the right hand side bottom of the plat the
information on the county commission is not required, both the area
labeled play ground and lot 27 are actually common areas. This
will be a condominium type of subdivision but according to our
ordinance and the desires of this Commission, those areas that are
obviously maintained areas need to be labeled. Lot 27 is not a
home lot. It is a green belt type of lot and needs to be labeled
common area.
Ernie Evans asked about the drainage area being an easement or a
common area?
Steve Simonson stated this should be a common area also. There is
one land owner that is not on the plat but technically is. It will
be the area stated "unimproved". This is still part of the City of
Schertz property.
Gary Wallace moved to table the Preliminary Plat approval for
Parkway Villas Retirement Community Gated submitted by Veytia
Partners, until the City Council Public Hearing on December 3rd and
the decisions on the Master Plan. Merwin Willman seconded the
motion which carried as follows:
AYES: Ernie Evans, David Richmond, Merwin Willman, Pia Jarman,
Gary Wallace.
NAYS: Tony Moreno.
*10
CONSIDER AND TAKE APPROPRIATE ACTION:
Bank and Trust on Schertz
Request from Schertz
Parkway. (PC #279-96)
A. Site Plan
B. Sign Variance
A. Site Plan:
Steve Simonson stated there are a few items missing: the vicinity
map, and the title of the applicant's name, they have labeled where
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the free standing sign will go. They have shown the type one and
type two lighting. All the trees that are going to be saved are
shown. They are requesting a variance of the building setback
which will have to go to the BOA. The building setback at this
time is minor as there is only a canopy that is affecting this.
However, they are requesting this request to go forward so that at
a future time if they wish to expand, it will have already been
taken care of.
Gary Wallace asked "Where are we going with signs. Are we getting
bigger and bigger?"
Steve Simonson stated we actually down-sized in the UDC. They are
requesting a 350 square feet surface plus an additional 20 feet of
height. The request for the sign is part of the site plan.
Merwin Willman stated the site plan shows plans to put two
driveways onto Schertz Parkway, that would allow for two curb cuts.
They will be approximately 120' apart. What is the reasoning for
two curb cuts on Schertz Parkway?
Bill Reeves stated the reason for this is that one is an entrance
only with a one way direction for the motor bank. "We are trying
to determine the amount of traffic that will be served by the bank
and the motor bank. There is an entrance and exit off of the
frontage road which would be used primarily for the bank and the
customers would have to go around the bank to get to the motor
bank. The first curb cut off of Schertz Parkway will be used for
the bank with the other curb cut used to service the motor bank.
There will be signage showing that it will be a one way. The bank
has made an extreme effort to save all of the oak trees. There
were a number of site plans looked at for the bank and motor bank
to be able to keep the trees to be harmonious with each other.
Ernie Evans asked if the trees that are being taken out
asphalt, not knowing the property boundaries, will have
addressed to the Commission.
by
to
the
be
Melvin Golla stated the way the plan was originally designed there
would have been a loss of nine trees. With this final plan that is
presented, now everyone of the oak trees has been saved, with the
exception of one that is located on the west boundary line. This
tree is eight feet away from the property line that cannot be saved
for a driveway to be put in safely. There are 22 large trees on
the property and this one tree is the only one that would have to
be removed. To get the traffic flow up to the building, this tree
will have to be removed so as to widen the drive up lane 10. If
there was some way to get around this tree they would have saved
it.
David Richmond asked about the area coming in having the drive come
right up to the property line instead of leaving the eight feet to
the tree, coming in shallower on the Schertz Parkway side of the
tree.
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Bill Reeves
needs to be
perpendicular
configuration,
stated in the approach to the commercial lane there
a 30' turning radius so that the car can get up
to the building. The non-commercial is a head on
the commercial is an actual drive up.
Melvin Golla stated because of the 30' radius, this is what is
creating the problem. There are twenty-two trees on the property;
there is just the one that will need to be removed, leaving
twenty-one trees that have a dimension of at least twelve inches or
better.
Gary Wallace asked why the seventy feet height on the sign?
Melvin Golla stated on the adjacent property there is a cluster of
three oak trees with a height of at least forty-five feet. When we
go to the maximum that the City allows, right now part of the sign
will be behind trees. "We felt like we would like to go to the
maximum that we could go which would be cost efficient on putting
the sign in. The seventy foot sign would be a 30' X 14' sign which
would be the most cost efficient. The seventy feet would be to the
top of the sign."
Merwin Willman stated in the overlay ordinance it specifies for a
20 foot setback on Schertz Parkway for a landscape buffer scenic
easement. This does not seem to be shown on the site plan. Is
this going to be waived?
.
Steve Simonson stated this is part of the ordinance: either waive
it or accept it. They are meeting the intent of the ordinance
because of the islands and the trees, but it would be up to the
Commission.
Ernie
is a
plan.
Evans stated this should be part of the whole package, if it
variance that has to be granted as an approval of the site
The site plan does not approve a variance.
Merwin Willman read from Article 7 paragraph 3.8 II a continuous
twenty foot wide landscape buffer or scenic easement will be
provided contiguous to the Schertz Parkway right-of-way. Trees, as
necessary, will be planted to provide an average density of one
tree per twenty feet along Schertz Parkway. Irrigation of this
landscaped buffer is encouraged and maintenance will be the
responsibility of the owner of the paved surface or property." If
this is not going to be required we will have to grant a variance.
Gary Wallace stated in regard to what Merwin brought up: if there
is not a specific variance, whether it is on the site plan or not,
they are required by the ordinance to comply. Ernie Evans stated
"yes" this is true.
.
Melvin Golla stated the bank is required to have a certain amount
of lighting and so much candle watts of power at certain positions
and areas around and on the bank. The lighting will be the same as
what is at our existing building on Main Street.
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Ernie Evans asked if there was sufficient handicap parking for the
business? Steve Simonson stated "yes" they have the required
number of handicap parking for the square foot and number of
people.
Merwin Willman moved to disapprove the request for the site plan
submitted by Schertz Bank and Trust on Schertz Parkway until the 20
foot buffer landscape buffer request variance is submitted, the
vicinity map is shown, and the property applicant information is
included. Tony Moreno seconded the motion which carried with a
unanimous vote.
B. Sign Variance:
Steve Simonson stated the letter is provided with the request for
the sign variance with a diagram showing the actual size, and the
location where it will be on the IH 35 access road. Mr. Golla
stated why they are requesting this variance. The size will exceed
by 100 square feet all the way around allowed for a free standing
sign.
David Richmond stated he has a problem with the increasing of the
height and the size of signs. What trees on the adjacent property
are there that are 40' high that we are concerned about?
Melvin Golla stated it is the property owned by the John's on the
corner of Schertz Parkway and IH 35 access. There is a cluster of
trees on the corner and they go as high as the electric lines on
the frontage road. If you were to put a 50 foot sign in height,
part of the sign would be obstructed by the trees.
Ernie Evans asked how far off the access road is the position of
the sign? Melvin Golla stated about 15 feet.
David Richmond stated the access road is coming up an incline. By
the time you get to the corner to turn right onto Schertz Parkway
you are pretty near the highest point. Given the access road, in
addition to the entrance/exit for IH 35 access road it presents a
sufficient line of sight for those traveling north to see the sign.
The request might be for the people traveling south to be able to
see the sign on IH 35.
Melvin Golla stated they had taken a boom truck up to the area with
an orange cone on top. The sign could be seen all the way south
from the bridge on FM 3009. Going north the sign could be seen
from the bridge over the Cibolo Creek. They were about 10' above
the trees for this. Going down IH 35 the closer you get to the
site the less you could see of the boom truck and the cone at the
70' level. With no control over the neighbor's trees, the variance
is needed so the sign could be seen for advertisement services.
Pia Jarman stated she understands the height but the oak trees were
mentioned earlier as being beautiful. Why would you then want to
dwarf them by having a very large sign?
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Melvin Golla stated the 250' size sign at the 50' level is very
visible and there are several of these signs already located on the
IH 35 access road going south from FM 3009. Going up the
additional 20 feet to the top of the sign the angle goes ahead and
makes the sign look smaller so that you cannot read it. It is a
visual type of deal. Even though the sign can be seen from the
locations as indicated you can read the sign from 600 hundred
yards. Any further than that you can tell it is a sign, but not
what it says. If you are going down IH 35 the highway does cut
down the visibility of the sign.
Ernie Evans asked if the sign is illuminated? Melvin stated "yes".
David Richmond stated he is concern about the height situation.
Schertz Bank is viewed a little differently than McDonald's or any
other fast food restaurant as these businesses are trying to appeal
to transit vehicles traffic on IH 35, whereas a bank is trying to
appeal to the residential clientele that knows your product and is
well established, and is going to principally be the same clientele
that you have now rather than appeal to people traveling on IH 35.
It would seem this type of sign need not compete with other objects
to be visible to vehicular traffic as maybe it would be for
something whose business is dependent on the traffic. This
business does not seem to be dependent on this type of traffic.
Melvin Golla stated since the time he has been here in Schertz the
basic traffic pattern has been through Schertz from IH 35 going to
Randolph. With all of the homes being built on FM 3009 and Schertz
Parkway and subdivisions in front of the board, you are going to
see a majority of the traffic is not going to be coming to the
downtown area any longer they are going to be going IH 35 and
exiting Schertz Parkway or FM 3009. We are trying to let people
know that we are out there. Not that they have to come to the old
down town but we are going to be out and want to be visible on the
highway.
Merwin Willman asked if a lower sign wouldn't do the same thing?
Melvin Golla stated it would do the same thing but it wouldn't be
as visible due to the oak trees.
Merwin Willman stated it may not be visible a mile down the road
but a bank necessarily doesn't need a sign like this. There is a
bank going in on FM 3009 and they are not putting in a big high
sign. They are putting in a sign that is approximately 7 1/2 feet
high about 12 1/2 feet wide. The credit union that is going across
from them also is having a small sign.
Melvin Golla stated it is their feeling that their bank needs a
sign like the one proposed. "We have been the bank in this
community since 1913 and we would like to stay that way. If other
banks want that type of sign then that is their prerogative but it
is our prerigative to request a sign variance."
David Richmond stated the other consideration to look at is the
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location which will be very close to the HEB complex location.
Regardless of signage HEB could have a two foot sign and they are
going to attract anything coming down IH 35. Rather than looking
now at one and two buildings going in the area, with the
development of the FM 3009 intersection, the increased candle
power, and visibility at all times, not approving variances to
larger signs will contribute to the aesthetics along with increase
of development up there. And still enable all businesses to
attract and appeal not only to their current clientele but new
business. David said he believes the 50' sign is adequate.
Merwin Willman stated the location is a prime location with traffic
off Schertz Parkway having to go past it whether from the north or
the south. The frontage road will also pass this location. As far
as attracting new business Merwin doesn't feel they need a big sign
to attract it.
Melvin Golla stated the 50' sign would not be visible on the
highway going north. If the Commission would like to go up to the
area, he would show them with a boom truck it cannot be seen. They
are more than willing to do this. They wouldn't be requesting this
sign variance if the 50' were adequate. When you bring the sign
down to 250 square feet you would not be able to tell the name on
it until you got within 300 yards of the sign.
Pia Jarman commented a bank is "an established financial
institution and as you say, you have been in the area a long time.
It is not the same thing as a fast food establishment that needs
the highway traffic. What is needed is PR and other information to
let people know where you are and that you are in perhaps a more
accessible location."
Ernie Evans asked if they have looked at a low profile sign to come
below the tree line. It almost seems like the variance would have
been for two signs: one on Schertz Parkway and one on IH 35
access, that would be low profile, which could be seen from
whatever angle.
Melvin Golla stated the canopy of the trees as such drape down
onto the property side, not the road side as the trees have
trimmed back along the access road. With the canopying coming
you are looking at about a 10 foot visibility at the most.
can you do with a sign under 10 feet?
back
been
down
What
Gary Wallace asked if there have been any variance in the past for
sign height in this area? Merwin stated "yes" but it depends on
their merit.
Gary Wallace asked what was the height of the signs?
Simonson stated 75'.
Steve
David Richmond asked what type of sign is at the present location?
Melvin
signs
Golla stated the initials are on the building with several
on the street. There was going to be a time and temperture
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sign on the property that is owned by the Southern Pacific at the
red light on First Street and FM 78, but there was a director who
was very adamant about this so they did not do it. The facial of
this sign is the same facial as the other sign. The one at the
branch in Kirby is about 35 feet if you are at 100 to 150 yards
from the building you cannot make out what that sign says.
David Richmond stated the basis for his questions was that the bank
does have low profile signs on Main Street and since 1913 it has
not been concerned with attracting from FM 78 because no one can
really see the bank from FM 78 unless they turn into the central
part of Schertz thus seeing the bank. Melvin stated that "yes"
this is true. But at one time back in about 1988 they were
thinking of putting in a sign on FM 78.
David Richmond
disapprove the
Schertz Parkway
them if they so
ordinance. Pia
follows:
moved for reasons stated in the discussion to
request submitted from Schertz Bank and Trust on
for a variance to the sign ordinance and require
desire to have a pole sign adhering to the sign
Jarman seconded the motion which carried as
AYES: Ernie Evans, David Richmond, Merwin Willman, Pia Jarman, and
Gary Wallace.
NAYS: Tony Moreno.
.
#11
CONSIDER AND TAKE APPROPRIATE ACTION: Request from Schertz
Bank and Trust for a Special Exception to the
Zoning Ordinance to reduce the 50' building
setback to 25' on Schertz Parkway. (BOA #82-96)
Steve Simonson stated this is a straight forward request as stated.
They antecipate growth at this site and at this time they are
basically needing the 25' building setback, however, due to future
growth they would like to expand if necessary and would like the
request approved now before they start the building.
.
Melvin Golla stated the building was designed to accommodate as
many cars as possible at their facility on Main Street. There are
six drive-in lanes. On Friday evenings people are parking on the
street to get into the bank. This facility was built in 1982 and
then they did not feel this facility would get to this point. At
the facility in Kirby there are seven lanes which are totally
behind the facility. In Schertz there are times that there is
traffic on FM 78 and Old Seguin Road trying to get into the bank.
When this project was started they tried to get a facility for 53
cars but they are down to about 40 cars. In the near future if the
area around this facility is going to go, they feel that it is
necessary to try to put some additional drive-thru lanes to
accommodate the customers that we hope to have there. Therefore
they need to accommodate them in such a fashion to get them off of
the street and onto the bank property. They are looking at
possibly putting in maybe another 2 or 3 lanes on the drive-in area
side. As seen on the plan they can hardly go west, so the only
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thing to do is to eliminate their employee parking which is along
Schertz Parkway and build the drive-in facility out in this area.
They might have to expand the building to the north and the west
which would be towards Schertz Parkway and IH 35 to accommodate the
customers as they grow, as they might in the next 3 to 5 years.
Bill Reeves stated in looking at the 60 X 60 office space there are
two projections coming off which is office space. They would in
fill these coming off and this would cross over the current 50'
setback line off Schertz Parkway and as Mr. Golla has mentioned,
as far as the motor bank, looking at possibly the elimination of
the employee parking or repositioning them to the back of the motor
bank, and the motor lanes to the side, which would definitely
exceed the 50' building setback.
Melvin Golla stated the whole project was designed for the safety
of their customers entering and leaving the facility.
David Richmond stated earlier this evening there was a denial based
on the fact that the 20' setback on Schertz Parkway was not
indicated. If they acknowledge the 20' setback on Schertz Parkway
which has to be a green area, then we approve the 25' setback such
that they can build to 25', then there is no way they could have
any road or anything left to the side of the building at a later
date besides concrete.
.
Mewin Willman stated if they expand, all the parking will be
eliminated. They either need to comply or ask for a variance.
Melvin Golla stated that the property of their project is tied up
in a visibility study. If it looks like they cannot go ahead and
build a facility or a possibility of getting a variance to some of
the City's ordinances, then it looks like they will have to look
elsewhere. They feel this project can be a "doable" project.
There is going to have to be some give and take here. "We have
seen down Schertz Parkway that there have been some setbacks
granted and this is why we are asking for the setbacks. As the
plat shows just where the property line ends, also where the curb
lines are we have in a sense talked with the highway department and
they are going to allow us to go ahead and plant grass around that
area of the IH 35 access. We will not be able to put in an
irrigation system in that area but only on our property that would
water that area. This has a lot to do with this plan site. The
property does not go all the way out to the curb. If you take this
into consideration this will be 20' of green space."
Gary Wallace moved to forward to BOA with approval the request
submitted by Schertz Bank and Trust for a Special Exception to the
Zoning Ordinance to reduce the 50' building setback to 25' on
Schertz Parkway. David Richmond seconded the motion which carried
with a unanimous vote.
.
#12 DISCUSSION: Traffic Management Ordinance.
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Ernie Evans stated this was tabled from last meeting.
be our discussion on traffic for the UDC. Is there a
have this discussion?
This was to
desire to
Merwin Willman mentioned he still has some questions that he feels
need to be answered. The one thing is they make a lot of reference
to publications. It sounds as if we need the publications to know
what they are talking about. How are we going to get these
publications?
Ernie Evans
Generation
More often
the formula
stated we have the most referenced one the Traffic
Manual. It has quite a few of the "definitions" in it.
than not they refer you to a table and you need to know
that is used for the calculations.
Merwin Willman mentioned with the information that we have now it
would be very hard to write an ordinance.
Gary Wallace stated he understands that the City would have
complete control over a subdivision. We have a skeleton of a
traffic study. The ordinance in its ideal frame work doesn't
coordinate. As a citizen or a person wanting to do something, he
sees it as bureaucracy, which is not good.
Steve Simonson stated one of the side lights that this is supposed
to address is that through streets are supposed to handle traffic.
One of the things that was envisioned was for example when you tell
a developer he has to have 30' streets instead of 42' streets, by
what authority do you tell them this? A good example would be in
Woodland Oaks. If you were to look at Dimrock and Woodland Oaks
Drive they should have been two 42' roads instead of a residential
30' road that is carrying all the traffic from the one end. One
will be a through road but looking at the master plan both of these
could have been justified for 42' roads. If you use the formula
which is basically the one San Antonio has adopted and is using
today. It can have you look at a situation sooner for traffic
control.
Merwin Willman
from which we
stated not of
request to.
asked if there were any city's around of our
could request their ordinance on traffic?
our size there is not one we could make
size
Steve
such a
Steve Simonson stated you have a copy of San Antonio's ordinance
that is lengthy and wordy, there is an example of the AACOG's. He
would be willing to tackle a pared down version after the first of
the year. Merwin stated he would like to get involved but he is
not sure where to start. Steve advised Merwin that the two of them
would tackle the project.
Ernie Evans stated
draft is fantastic.
read the examples
difficult with the
the concept of Steve and Merwin looking at a
Ernie agrees with Merwin depending on how you
on what you know or need to know, it is very
information that we have available thus far.
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This is still a good thing for us to pursue because down the road
it gives us leverage that we do not have today as we speak to the
developers. This will not be a bureaucracy as it does not affect
our common citizens who already live here. It effects the
developer.
Ernie Evans asked if the Commission wanted this item off the
agenda?
Mewin Willman
little better
meeting.
stated "yes" until we can come up with something a
and there is no need to discuss this item at every
#13 GENERAL DISCUSSION:
Tony Moreno:
Tony Moreno stated he has no comments.
Gary Wallace:
Gary Wallace stated he has no comments.
Pia Jarman:
Pia Jarman asked if the meeting on December 24th will be canceled.
It will be on the next agenda as advised by Denise.
Pia Jarman stated that in the hand-out Ernie had given out on the
making of motions, she was reminded of something Merwin mentioned
some time ago. He had said that Public Hearings were conducted
within our regular meetings. Since Pia's becoming a member of the
Commission, public hearings have been conducted as a separate
event. According to the handout and according to what Merwin had
mentioned it looks like we should have a regular session start and
then we go into a public hearing. Then the public hearing is
closed and we continue on with the regular session with the
discussion making phase. Before the next public hearing if we are
doing something incorrect we need to correct it.
Merwin Willman mentioned that was just recommendations by
person writing the article. Merwin did not remember having
such a comment about the Public Hearing.
the
made
Steve Simonson stated since he has been here it hasn't been like
that.
Ernie Evans stated the way we are doing it now we open with the
public hearing. Pia said the way it is described places the public
hearing as a separate entity within a regular meeting. You start
off with the regular meeting and then go into public hearing, close
public hearing, and resume the regular meeting.
David Richmond also stated the author mentions this is his opinion
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. and puts it into no precedence.
Merwin Willman:
Mewin Willman stated he has no comments.
David Richmond:
David Richmond stated he has no comments.
Councilman Ken Greenwald:
Councilman Ken Greenwald said it was mentioned at the last City
Council workshop one of the council members has a problem meeting
on Wednesday nights. How many of the Commission would be affected
if the meeting was moved to Wednesday night? This would be the
second and fourth Wednesday's.
Ernie Evans advised the Commissioners to look at their calenders
and at the next meeting let Councilman Ken Greenwald know.
Steve Simonson:
.
Steve Simonson stated as a reminder the Christmas tree lighting
will be on Thursday December 5th at 6:30 p.m. There will be a new
tree with lots of lights.
Ernie Evans:
Ernie Evans stated for the benefit of those who have not been
following the pending items, we have added a few and dropped a few.
The last meeting there was a letter needed from the property owner
on the sign going on FM 3009.
Steve Simonson stated the letter from the property owner was
received and the size met the standards for a bill board on FM
3009.
#14 ADJOURNMENT:
David Richmond moved to adjourn the meeting. Pia Jarman seconded
the motion, which carried with a unanimous vote.
Chairman Ernie Evans adjourned the meeting at 9:35 p.m.
The next regularly scheduled meeting
10, 1996.
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Zoning Commission
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ATTEST:
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Planning Se'cretary ,
City of Schertz, Texas
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