11-28-1989 n/s4t5D TF"
PLANNING AND ZONING MINUTES
FILE
The Schertz Planning and Zoning Commission convened in a regular
session on Tuesday, November 28, 1989 at 7:00 P.M. in the
Municipal Complex Conference Room, 1400 Schertz Parkway. Those
present were as follows:
PLANNING & ZONING COMMISSION OTHERS PRESENT
TY BRISGILL, CHAIRMAN
KEITH VAN DINE, SECRETARY
MERWIN WILLMAN
BOB ANDREWS
GEORGE VICK
JIM SHRIVER
KEN GREENWALD, COUNCILPERSON
MEMBERS ABSENT
JOE POTEMPA, VICE - CHAIRMAN
#1 CALL TO ORDER
JOHN WILKERSON, SOUTHWEST NEON
R.G. STILL, CONOCO
HAROLD STONE, PAYLESS GAS
GLENN HOFFPAUIR, VINTAGE
CUSTOM HOMES
JAMES ANDERSON, ETJ REP.
CITY STAFF
STEVE SIMONSON, ASST. CITY MGR.
NORMA ALTHOUSE, RECORDING SEC'Y.
Chairman Brisgill called the meeting to order at 7:00 P.M.
#2 APPROVAL OF MINUTES: Regular Session November 14, 1989
Steve Simonson asked that on page 9, paragraph 9, under Steve
Simonson, the word "pig" in the first sentence be changed to
"hog" and the second sentence be changed to read as follows: "Mr.
Simonson said finally a nice man offered the use of his equipment
to help ". Then add a third sentence: "The next morning it was
discovered the hog had broken through the fence and wandered
away."
There being no further corrections or additions, Bob Andrews made
a motion to approve the minutes, as amended, for the regular
session November 14, 1989. Merwin Willman seconded the motion
and the vote was as follows:
AYES: K. Van Dine, M. Willman, B. Andrews, G. Vick, J. Shriver
NAYS: None
ABSTENTIONS: T. Brisgill
Motion carried.
#3 CITIZENS' INPUT OTHER THAN AGENDA ITEMS
There was none.
#4 CONSIDER AND MAKE RECOMMENDATION: Request from Vintage
Homes, Inc. for Preliminary and Final
Approval of a Replat of Lots 13 and 14, Block
7 to Lot 21, Block 7, Savannah Square
Subdivision, Unit 1
Glenn Hoffpauir was at the meeting to represent this request.
Chairman Brisgill asked for Staff input. Steve Simonson
commented since Lots 13 and 14 are adjacent to already
constructed homes, they fall within 500 feet of already platted
lots and according to the Subdivision Ordinance under Section
16.5, we are required to have a public hearing.
Mr. Simonson also mentioned the following corrections which need
to be made to the plat:
J (a) Replace the Word Original with Vacate.
(b) Plat must contain statement concerning the 100 year flood
plain.
(c) Plat must be signed by owner and surveyor.
(d) Replace the statement for signature of Commissioners Court of
Guadalupe County with the proper statement for recordation in
Guadalupe County. .
George Vick made a motion to recommend this request be scheduled
for a public hearing. Bob Andrews seconded the motion and the
vote was unanimous in favor. Motion carried.
After discussion about the upcoming schedule, it was decided to
schedule this public hearing for January 9th in conjunction with
the public hearing for zoning on the properties proposed for
annexation.
#5 CONSIDER AND TAKE APPROPRIATE ACTION: John Wilkerson, on
Behalf of Payless Gas at IH -35 and FM 1103,
Request for Variance to Sign Ordinance to
Allow Additional Sign on IH -35 (Already Has
One, This Will Make Two on Same Thoroughfare)
John Wilkerson, R.G. Still, and Harold Stone were at the meeting
to represent this request.
Chairman Brisgill asked for Staff input. Steve Simonson informed
the Commission the Staff had interpreted the ordinance as meaning
Payless is allowed two signs, one on each thoroughfare. Mr.
Simonson said Payless is requesting that both signs be located on
IH -35.
Merwin Willman disagreed with the Staff interpretation and
referred to Page 1, Article II, Paragraph 1. (amended by Ord. 87-
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S-13, 6- 16 -87) which says: "All businesses shall be authorized
two (2) signs - one (1) sign on the building and one (1) free-
standing sign ".
Bob Andrews then pointed out Page 11, Section 5c.(1) which says:
"On corner lots, that frontage on a major or primary street shall
be construed to be the development lot frontage. No more than
one (1) sign shall be permitted, except on a development lot
located at the intersection of two major thoroughfares or two
expressways /interstates or a major thoroughfare and an
expressway /interstate. A free-standing sign shall be permitted
on each thoroughfare or expressway /interstate or one (1) sign, of
the same size, height and setback, may be placed on the corner,
provided it is not within the visibility triangle ".
John Wilkerson spoke at this time saying the easement cuts off a
big hunk of the property and there are only two places to put
signs where they can be seen. Mr. Wilkerson also told the
Commission they are changing from Shell to Conoco gas and their
customers need to be able to see the Conoco sign.
Chairman Brisgill commented he had driven out by the property and
noticed the house and trees next door. Mr. Brisgill asked how
high the sign will be and questioned if it won't be obscured by
the trees.
John Wilkerson replied the sign will be approximately 45 feet and
said he thinks the trees are probably about 40 feet high.
Chairman Brisgill remarked he doesn't see how this sign will have
better visibility.
John Wilkerson noted that the sign will be next to the trees so
it won't be shaded by them.
Chairman Brisgill then asked about when the trees grow - there's
no room for growth.
John Wilkerson said they could go as high as 50 feet with no
problem.
Chairman Brisgill asked how far back from the property line the
sign will be located and John Wilkerson replied approximately 42
feet.
Bob Andrews told John Wilkerson he can see the need for the one
sign, but not for two.
Merwin Willman then asked why the current sign can't be raised to
50 feet instead of having two signs.
Harold Stone from Payless Gas indicated they would have to
rebuild the sign if they did that because of the foundation.
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C-1.
Jim Shriver made a motion to approve the request from John
Wilkerson, on behalf of Payless Gas at IH -35 and FM 1103, for a
variance to the Sign Ordinance allowing them to put an additional
sign on IH -35. George Vick seconded the motion and the vote was
as follows:
AYES: K. Van Dine, G. Vick. J. Shriver
NAYS: T. Brisgill, M. Willman, B. Andrews
ABSTENTIONS: None
Motion did not carry.
Bob Andrews once again stated he can see need for the high -rise
sign on IH -35, but not the need for the second sign.
Greg Still of Conoco emphasized it is better to use the current
sign and convert it rather than tear it down. Mr. Still also
said they need the Payless name on their sign for recognition and
also if they put the price on the high -rise sign, the numbers
cannot be seen.
Bob Andrews asked if they find that people really look at the
price or just look for the brand. Mr. Still replied they have
found people do look for the price.
Chairman Brisgill again brought up the height of the trees and
expressed the opinion he does not think the second sign is going
to help.
Jim Shriver (for the second time) made a motion to approve the
request from John Wilkerson, on behalf of Payless Gas at IH -35
and FM 1103, for a variance to the Sign Ordinance allowing them
to put an additional sign on IH -35. George Vick seconded the
motion and the vote was as follows:
AYES: K. Van Dine, G. Vick. J. Shriver
NAYS: T. Brisgill, M. Willman, B. Andrews
ABSTENTIONS: None
Again, the motion did not carry.
Greg Still insisted they need the existing sign to say Payless
and to list the prices.
Bob Andrews asked, when they took the boom up, what the
visibility was on FM 1103. John Wilkerson said from FM 1103 you
miss the little sign on IH -35, but you can see the big one until
you get down into the valley and then you can see only the little
one.
Keith Van Dine made a motion to table, until the next regularly
scheduled meeting, (at which time it is hoped all seven members
of the Commission will be present) the request from John
Wilkerson, on behalf of Payless Gas at IH -35 and FM 1103, for a
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variance to the Sign Ordinance allowing them to put an additional
sign on IH -35. Bob Andrews seconded the motion and the vote was
as follows:
AYES: T. Brisgill, K. Van Dine, M. Willman, B. Andrews, J.
Shriver
NAYS: None
ABSTENTIONS: G. Vick
Motion carried.
Bob Andrews suggested Mr. Wilkerson bring better sketches with
dimensions to the next meeting.
#6 CONSIDER AND MAKE RECOMMENDATION: John Wilkerson, on Behalf
of Payless Gas At Jack Hays Blvd. and Borgfeld
Rd., Request for 13' 7" Variance to
Requirements of Special Overlay District of
Zoning Ordinance for a Low - Profile Type Sign
As with the previous Item, John Wilkerson, R.G. Still, and Harold
Stone were at the meeting to represent this request.
Chairman Brisgill asked for Staff input. Steve Simonson advised
the Commission this request falls under the Overlay District
section of the Zoning Ordinance in Section 2 (e) 6. which states:
"Each business is permitted to have one (1) attached low profile
type sign not attached to the building. The sign shall be
approved, by the. Planning and Zoning Commission, prior to
construction. Sign shall be a low profile type, normally not to
exceed five (5') feet,. and the maximum allowed size does not
exceed forty -one hundredths (0.40) square feet for every foot of
frontage along FM 3009 right -of -way with a maximum size of one
hundred (100) square feet allowed."
Mr. Simonson continued on saying since we know Jack Hays Blvd.
will be widened, this sign appears to be in the triangle that
will be taken.
Greg Still was asked what they plan to do with the present sign
and he replied it will be taken down. Mr. Still said the
Payless sign under the canopy will come down and they will leave
the logo on the four corners.
Steve Simonson informed Mr. Still any new sign will have to go
outside where the triangle area will be after Jack Hays Blvd. is
widened.
Bob Andrews asked Greg Still if they had received the right -of-
way information and Mr. Still replied they had not.
Jim Shriver asked Greg Still if they are willing to put the sign
where it needs to be and was informed they are willing.
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Keith Van Dine then questioned if the Commission would need a new
request from Payless, but Councilperson Ken Greenwald indicated
the change could be proven with the right -of -way maps.
After some discussion on the size of the proposed sign, Bob
Andrews made a motion to recommend to City Council that the
request from John Wilkerson, on behalf of Payless Gas at Jack
Hays Blvd. and Borgfeld Rd., for a 13' 7" variance to the
requirements of the Special Overlay District of the Zoning
Ordinance (for a low - profile type sign) be scheduled for a public
hearing.
Merwin Willman seconded the motion and the vote was unanimous in
favor. Motion carried.
The Commission will hold a public hearing on this request prior
to the public hearing to be scheduled by Council. The date for
the Commission's public hearing was set for January 23, 1990.
#7 CONSIDER AND TAKE APPROPRIATE ACTION: Approval of Handouts
for Zoning Public Hearing
Merwin Willman had written up a handout explaining the proposed
zoning on the five tracts of land being annexed. In the handout,
Mr. Willman gave the reason for the proposed type of zoning,
explained something about the particular zoning, explained that
the Zoning Ordinance contains a schedule of uses for different
zonings and how some uses are nonconforming, and listed some of
the restrictions for a particular zoning. Also included in the
handout, on the back of each page containing all the above
information, is a map showing the location of the tract being
annexed.
Mr. Willman commented he had written up this handout in an effort
to eliminate some of the problems that arise when land is being
zoned.
The Commission agreed it is an excellent idea.
Jim Shriver made a motion to approve the handouts and suggested
they be included with the notices sent to the property owners
regarding the public hearing on zoning. It was also suggested
copies of the handout be available at the Municipal Complex for
any citizen wishing to obtain one.
Bob Andrews seconded the motion and the vote was unanimous in
favor. Motion carried.
#8 CONSIDER AND MAKE RECOMMENDATION: Discussion on Amendment
to Sign Ordinance Regarding Garage Sale Signs
Chairman Brisgill asked Merwin Willman for input. Mr. Willman
remarked that during the Council workshop on October 11, 1989, it
was suggested controls be established on garage sale signs,
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therefore he wrote up a proposed amendment to the Sign Ordinance
regarding garage sale signs.
Chairman Brisgill noted the only problem he sees with this is the
enforcement.
Councilperson Ken Greenwald told Mr. Brisgill that if this
amendment goes to City Council, he will bring up the enforcement.
Jim Shriver was very adamant about the fact that he objects to
this entire amendment on garage sale signs.
At this time the Commission reviewed what Merwin Willman had
written up and offered their comments and suggestions. They did
make a few changes to the original proposal.
Bob Andrews made a motion to forward this proposed amendment to
the Sign Ordinance regarding garage sale signs, with the
' suggested changes, to City Council for their consideration. Mr.
Andrews asked that it be noted some of the Commission members
feel parts of it are not enforceable.
Chairman Brisgill suggested giving Council what we have and
asking them for their input. Mr. Brisgill said this should not
be considered the finished product, but we should get input back
from the Council in order to complete it.
At this time Bob Andrews withdrew his motion.
There was further discussion with agreement that the context is
good, but points of it not enforceable as the City stands now.
Bob Andrews again made a motion to forward this proposed
amendment to the Sign Ordinance regarding garage sale signs, with
the suggested changes, to City Council for their consideration.
Mr. Andrews asked that it be forwarded with the understanding it
is not to be considered the finished product - the Commission is
asking for input from the Council. Mr. Andrews also asked that
it be noted that several of the members do not feel this proposed
amendment, as a whole, could be implemented because, in their
opinion, some of it is not enforceable.
Keith Van Dine seconded the motion and the vote was as follows:
AYES: T. Brisgill, K. Van Dine, M. Willman, B. Andrews, G. Vick
NAYS: J. Shriver
ABSTENTIONS: None
Motion carried.
Jim Shriver asked that his opposition to this amendment be
conveyed to the Council. It will be so noted when the
recommendation is forwarded.
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#9 GENERAL DISCUSSION
Jim Shriver•
(a) There is a dangerous situation, with the potential for an
accident, at Lindbergh and Main. When you are taking Lindbergh
to the left, the view is blocked by cars parked in front of True
Value.
Councilperson Ken Greenwald and Steve Simonson both agreed the
first thing to do is have the Police Department check on their
traffic control records regarding that intersection.
George Vick:
(a) What's going on at 13th Row? Steve Simonson said the City is
cleaning up.
Steve Simonson:
(a) The City has obtained, from the railroad, the right -of -way on
FM 78. The Bexar County/ Universal City side will be a much
tougher problem and will be needed before we can go ahead.
Chairman Brisgill:
(a) The demographics letter to Donnelley Marketing is good -
don't know if there will be any results, but it's good.
(b) Everyone needs to look at the Payless Gas signs before the
next meeting.
#10 ADJOURNMENT
Chairman Brisgill adjourned the regular session at 8:53 P.M.
The Commission took a short break at this time.
The Schertz Planning and Zoning Commission convened in a special
session, after the regular session, in the Municipal Complex
Conference Room, 1400 Schertz Parkway. Tony Bagwell and Mickey
Fishbeck of Rimrock Consulting Company and Ed Ford of Ford
Engineering were present for the special session.
#11 CALL TO ORDER
Chairman Brisgill called the meeting to order at 9:00 P.M. and
turned it over to Tony Bagwell.
#12 ADVISORY COMMITTEE MEETING: Specific SB336 Requirements:
Determination of Local Objectives; Finalize Service
Area Determination; Presentation of Preliminary
Land Use Assumptions and Unit Usage Assumptions
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Mr. Bagwell gave a chart to the Commission showing comparison of
costs of alternative municipal financing approaches. The chart
showed the municipal revenue bonding approach and the capital
recovery fee approach. Mr. Bagwell commented that capital
recovery fees help keep rate increases down caused by new
development.
Tony Bagwell informed the Commission SB336 requires that in 10
years the City look back and see if fees actually exceeded the
true cost of service. If they did exceed the true cost of
service by more than 100, the City is liable for refunds.
Mr. Bagwell emphasized they are here to provide technical help
and the Advisory Committee provides guidance, input and comments.
Jim Shriver asked Tony Bagwell, if in working with other cities,
do the others understand the material handed out to them. Mr.
Bagwell replied they understand to some degree.
George Vick mentioned they are developing a Capital Improvement
Plan (CIP)and he has never done one before.
Bob Andrews commented, if he understands it correctly, when the
process is finished, Rimrock Consulting will be giving the
Advisory Committee a CIP for approval and Tony Bagwell said that
is correct.
Jim Shriver asked who's supposed to be accomplishing the
establishment of a CIP, the Advisory Committee or Rimrock
Consulting. Tony Bagwell replied it is a joint effort.
Chairman Brisgill expressed his concern about understanding all
the legal data.
Councilperson Ken Greenwald told Mr. Brisgill that Rimrock
Consulting is just providing them the background information for
the legal precedent of SB336.
Jim Shriver asked if they could have a copy of the law. Tony
Bagwell replied yes, he will see that they get one.
James Anderson stated it would be advisable to have maps showing
the City limits, ETJ's, proposed annexations, etc.
George Vick had questioned which utilities they are talking about
and Tony Bagwell said water /wastewater. Mr. Bagwell related
there had been discussion on the possibility of capital recovery
fees for drainage, but Council has not directed them to go
forward on that.
There was a brief discussion on the schedule and Steve Simonson
remarked they are under the burden of a time frame.
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Chairman Brisgill acknowledged he has a lot of concern on passing
things they don't understand.
Steve Simonson informed the Commission if they don't meet the
time frame, what it means is the City cannot charge capital
recovery fees until such time as they have a CIP.
Jim Shriver asked how many hours they're talking about to
complete the process.
Tony Bagwell said to get to the end product, it takes about nine
steps and the first step is utility demand projections for the
next ten years.
Steve Simonson asked if they are going to have maps to look at
for determining the land uses and Tony Bagwell replied yes they
will.
There was discussion on the conceptual service area and on
projecting demands and Tony Bagwell said they need to look at
projected demands on a City -wide level for the next ten years and
use it as a basis for developing impact fees.
Mr. Bagwell explained that water service areas are determined by
regulatory constraints, but wastewater service areas are usually
more dependent on topographical constraints.
At this time Ed Ford spoke to the Commission.
Mr. Ford told the Commission they will be using the zoning.map as
the land use map and also as the map for outlining the current
and conceptual service areas. Mr. Ford advised that if they use
the chart for usage based on zonings, it will enable them to look
at the ultimate development.
Ed Ford continued on, saying the City of Schertz is pretty well
landlocked as far as service areas.
Mr. Ford said his firm did a major water study six years ago and
Converse, Schertz and Boerne were listed as the fastest growing
cities, but because of the downturn in the economy, things came
to a dead stop.
There was a discussion on development in the Schirmerville area
with Steve Simonson saying that as far as sewer lines go, no one
has thoughts right now of going south. However, because of I -10
and the possibility it provides for the future, it was felt this
area should not be overlooked when projecting ultimate
development.
There was then a brief discussion on rates and Steve Simonson
commented whatever the rate is for water is applicable to the
entire City, however the sewer rate is dependent upon whatever
treatment facility provides the service.
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Jim Shriver asked how often the fees can be changed. Tony
Bagwell replied that by law the City has to look at them every
three years, but they can be updated as often as you want if you
are willing to go through the process.
Merwin Willman asked if it would be possible for the Advisory
Committee to have a smaller version of the large zoning map which
would also include the water service area, and Ed Ford replied he
will provide smaller maps for them.
Tony Bagwell remarked the public hearing notice published in the
newspaper has to include the map.
Mickey Fishbeck then distributed to the Commission replacement
pages, an executive summary, and a text to be read before the
next meeting.
#13 ADJOURNMENT
Chairman Brisgill adjourned the meeting at 10:26 P.M.
The next regular and special session are scheduled for December
12, 1989.
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